Pink Poogle Toy Forum

Fair points Qanda. But there may be ways around them.

The first point you raise is quite important. I'm no techie either, but I know that if this was done correctly it could work out. Neomails may not even be needed. The item could just be recieved through a random event. Lets say that an account has been frozen for 12 months (or 18 or whatever), all the items in it's SDB, trades, shop, inventory, whatever, are all given out in random events. So it'll be a sort of draw of chance. No neomails needed. Ne replies needed. That solves one problem already.

I think that maybe the 'giving account' should give away it's items the moment its expiration date is reached. There'll be no need to store the items in any limbo until the 5th of the month. No, just ever item being given out in a series of Random Events to random people.

Multi Accounts are the biggest issue here. The one thing TNT NEED TO DO is allow users to place tabs on their spare accounts, and also ask that users to state if any family members log in from the same IP. That way, they can also prevent family members from interacting with each other in the Neo World (harsh, true, but why would you wanna send your brother a neomail?), sot hat in the case that someone is lying, they can't send any extra stuff to their various accounts. This will also allow TNT to make sure that every user ONLY has 4 accounts. And if anyone unregistered makes an account on the same IP and interacts somehow with any of the other accounts, the spare account could be warned, then suspended. Bingo, problem solved, not to mention a lot less unneeded freezings.

Now, we all know there is another agenda here. I admit that I would LOVE to recieve a random Jade Scorchstone. But doing so would also stop the rampant inflation. And remember that certain items will still be lost due to glitches, sloth's ray, evil pink grundo thing, etc. Placing the items in the shops wouldn't be a fair system for those with slow internet, or just really pathetic restocking skills (like me). Not to mention that the shop would be flooded with items so much that TNT would need to systematically empty the shop, which would completely drive away the whole point of this system. And plus, if you meant putting them into the shops they came from, what will you do about items like retired HT items? You can't just put them back in there. Or what about promotional items which can't be bought at all?

And lets face it,rags-to-riches stories are always nice to hear about anyway, even if they'll occur 1000 times more often than before

Well if the items were stocked in a shop (Randomly appearing and masked) then it wouldn't stress the servers as much (Not needing to Neomail + Have activation links + Keep tabs on IP addresses etc) and it would stop the Multiple Account issue

It would be a gamble buying a Mystery Bag at 50,000 NP each but it could easily pay off if you got something good

Yeah, but 50,000 is a HUGE gamble, especially if you're a person like me, who lives in the shadow of those with over 20mil. I have barely 600k. I feel nervous whenever I spend over 150k. So spending 50k in one blow is something I would never do, nor would a lot of people.

Considering the amount of junk some people like to collect, one frozen account will be able to produce up to over a thousand different types of items (especially if that person was just going for the pack rat avatar). Now, consider the fact that each day a fair amount of people get frozen, and at least 1 decent player gets permanantly frozen (sad, but most likely true).

Let's say that that decent player has roughly 400 items altogether. Thats automatically 400 items into that shop, which will automatically mean MEGA lag. Add that to the amount of new memberish items such as half eaten jellies and wooden blocking shields. So even this system has it's faults, because all the best restockers will quickly skim for any items that are one of a kind in the hope that it's super rare, whilst people like me sit by in the dust opening random 'mystery bags' hoping to get something other than a pathetic kind of jelly. And this will also mean that only those who sit by that shop 24/7 will have a chance of getting anything good.

So basically, it'll just become another the-rich-become-richer story, as the poor waste away in their dust.

Random events are the way to go in regards to fairness. But in regards to the amount of work TNT would have to do, the shop would be the best option. Both have their pros and cons, though I stand in my belief that random events would be the best solution.

No, anything under a certain Rarity and under a certain Est. Price would be discarded from the account.

Or maybe they only take the good items but for every 1 good item they add in 19 consolation prizes...


And with the fast people sitting in the shop...

The shop would constantly have x amount of items in it. Everytime something was bought it would be replaced by another item. There would be a max of bags you could buy each day (EG : 5 bags max) so even dial-up users could get 5 a day if wanted

Hmm.... not a bad idea actually, I admit. The only problem is...

What would define a 'good item?' Anything r98 or higher? Don't think that'll work, because as we know, there are plenty of r98 or so items which for some reason are worth less than 500np, whilst certain items like Magic Cookies which (back when the WoE disease was Sneezles) would be defined as 'crappy' according to the system, whilst many newbies were willing to scam to get one.

Also, code redemption items are another issue. Some are worth MASSIVE amounts of NP, whilst others are really quite pathetic. And if I'm not mistaken (please tell me if I am), they're all classified under the same rareity.

And even 'speical item' r101 or higher can be problems, because Ommelettes (sp?) are worth practically nothing, whilst other items of the same rareity are worth a lot more.

The only other option would be to classify ever single item as either good or bad, and they would constantly need to update the list. Do you know how much hassle that'd be? I know that I wouldn't want to sift through over 11,000 different items, writing either good or bad next to them. True, it'd probably be less work in the short term than the whole tabbing system and whatnot, but in the long term, it'd mean they'll need to update the list every time they come out with more news.

That's where the EST Value comes into play as well. That is put on when the item comes out so it's a good place to gauge the "good" or "bad"ness of an item

EG :

A Green Pepper Omelette is Rarity 107
It's EST Value is 495 NP

Rarity = Good
EST Val. = Bad

Ruling = Bad. Rejected.

Yeah, but everyone knows you can't trust the estimated value!
Unless the estimated value was set to sync with the shop wiz's average price for the item, but then uber-rare items like certain paintbrushes would all be priced at 100k

Let me give you an example:

Spooky Teasure Map
Est value: 1,375 NP
Real Value: over 6k


Bag of Peanuts
Est value : 581 NP
Real Value: over 70k


And that's just a few examples. I also assume that retired HT items keep the same Est value they had when they were in the HT, so a Faeire PB would be worth 200k according to this system, right?

I think it is up to TNT whether or not they like having random people getting from rags to riches without having to put in any effort. The main issue here is that rare items are getting rarer due some being lost through frozen accounts, thus causing inflation. So we should focus on getting them back into ciruclation, thus solving the problem stated, and not on how TNT can aid random players into becoming rich overnight.

May I also point out that not everyone is agreeable with the idea of "rags to riches", and you cannot attribute your poverty to a lack of skills, since if you are lousy at the game you cannot reasonably expect to be succesful. I understand also the issue of slow internet connections, but unfortunately the main issue here is not to debate on how to make the game fairer to them (note that having this system will not make it any fairer for people with slow internet connections either, it is all luck and a rich person has an equally likely chance of getting a good item as a poor person).

Wow, well, I have to agree to some extent with that. TNT may not like to have so many people becoming rich very quickly overnight. But it does happen nonethless with RE's.

What I am trying to do here is to find a way to make a new system to allow retired items to recirculate around the community, and to lower inflation a little, since at the rate it is now, newbies have to work extremely long to attain one single goal. I am trying to suggest a system that will not result in hundreds of angry emails to TNT complaining of the unfairness of it. No one can complain about random events because they are random. Now, if a rich account is frozen permanantly, never to return, and passes it's expiration date, the best option in TNT's case would be to hand out the items randomly. Putting it in a shop will result in massive lag in that shop, since a fair few hundred, if not thousand of people will be in there at once, trying to snatch up a good deal.

Now, I've provided enough evidence to support my case. Shapu's system is both fair, and efficient if carried out correctly. I've provided more than enough evidence on that. What is happening now, is that you are attacking the whole 'rags to riches' deal, because you do not wish to see someone earn something great, whilst you who have worked for months attaining that goal, will feel as if your time was wasted. Am I correct in saying that?

I can tell you right now that I do not have too many great items. But lets take one of them , my Honey Potion, as an example. I worked so long to buy that potion. Months. And when I got it, I was proud of myself. But oddly enough, if some random 5 month old account got one out of sheer luck, I would be one of the first to be congratulating them.

I'm just grumpy and tired right now, so I'm sorry if I offended you or anything. But I just got a bit put off when you claimed that I am *ahem* "lousy at the game" and that I am poor. I'm not rich, but I aint poor, thats for sure.

Not sure if this has been said. But I only have a minuite to write a responce and only got to about page 3

I think rather than randomly distributing them to accounts who were last seen within 3 month or so. They should randomly be distributed in normal random events? So active players would be the only ones to benefit.

Not saying overly active. Just that once they are online, doing stuff. They all have a chance at getting something.

*Thinks about pumpkin sticks and the like*

There will be the problem of autorefreshers or the traditional method of placing a weight on the F5 key. This will be quite severe since if rare items are given out through REs, the stakes are higher and the chances of getting a good RE is much higher, and people will resort to a lot of refreshing.



No, I am not too bothered if someone gets rich suddenly, but you've got to agree that many veteran players will not like this scheme (as have been echoed by a few people here). Players will feel frustrated and the sense of achievement they get from acquiring something expensive through their own hard work and the sense of pride of owning such an item will be diminished.



Sorry for not phrasing myself clearly, but I was not referring to you when I said that. I meant "you" in general, as in we players cannot complain that we are poor if we are lousy at the game, since no one can reasonably expect to be succesful at any game if they aren't good at it.

Hence the suggestion that this be done through neomail.

Oe of the things about this idea, and one that I'm not sure I've explained clearly enough, is that we not all users will get Jade scorchstones or Jerans Swords or Coltzan Stamps.

The main objection seems to be that Johnny New Member will get a Jade SS, and sell it for 20k or something, thus completely undermining the economy of super-rare items.

But I disagree. Chances are much greater that Johnny New Member will get a scratchard, or a carrot and pea omelette - simple fact is that there would be more common items than rare items.

I don't think that going rags to riches will be as common as may be perceived - I'm sure there will be a few players who come into more money than they know what to do with. This happens in the real world anyway. And even on Neopets..."The vending machine gives you a golden nerkmid X, an Electric Paint Brush, and 225,000 neopoints!"

There are no complaints about this system that I've heard.

As for implementation, I suggested using neomail to alert winners merely because, as I said, it seemed easiest. And item transfer is pretty easy, too. Thousands of items get transferred across neopets every day, through the "give to neofriend" function. I don't think that doubling or even tripling that would be all that hard, considering that the servers seem to move pretty fast most of the time anyway. And even if they did slow down for five minutes while all of this is processed, wouldn't it be worth it?

I don't mind only pulling items out of half or a quarter, or even 10% of frozen accounts. What I mind is that so many rare items are stuck in accounts that are FROZEN. These accounts, in good portion, got these items and removed them from circulation by unfair means. This means that even though somebody paid 50 million NPs for a jade scorchstone (check the post, that's where they're at this morning), they got ripped off.

And I don't think this should be done instantaneously. It should be done with a fair warning, so that people who trade in high-end items can find a way to protect their expenditures. But if you're buying a high-end item solely to profit from it, then basically, you're restocking. Keep this in mind: Restocking is a risk/reward activity - you don't always come out ahead. Sometimes you win, and sometimes you lose.

I don't think that the market would bottom out, anyway. Not all of these items would come back into circulation, because of the restrictions I proposed in the first post. Self-freezes would be exempt, as would "Game cheaters," many of whom didn't actually cheat.

Back to distribution: Having a constantly-updating shop WOULD be a drain on the servers. Like I said, I don't mind secret-box auctions. But I don't think a click-through would be all that hard. Every item in neopia has a specific ID number. Two green apples have two different IDs. And every user account has a specific ID number as well, I'm sure. So a clickthrough system would be as simple as


And every user would receive a different number. If every active account were sent one of these emails, then it would be as simple as each account getting assigned an item id number in whatever database or db manipulation protocol they used.

As for timing, I still think it should only be done once a month, or at a staff member's behest. If this is done daily, or four times a day, eventually they will run out of items and the flow will stem. My preference is for this to be done in such a way that the flow of items might slow slightly (because there are more accounts now than there were 18 months ago), but not too much.

As for account age restrictions, that actually seems like a good idea. If you've been around a while, chances are you've worked hard and you deserve a reward for that more than a dude who's been around 3 hours or so. But the restriction should be reasonable - why not have it be, say, 3 months? That's a good time frame to see if somebody's going to stick around a little while longer, and chances are that with the thought of sugarplums or the equivalent dancing through their heads, they just might.

Which, in the end, is good for neopets, just as it is good for everyone else.

I have read all of the arguments and still think it is a great idea.

One suggestion that might be able to alleviate the logistics and lag that a few people brought up: Why not pattern it after a freebie, like the advent calendar? On the 5th day of each month, you can visit the "Confiscated Goods" guy. Only once. And with the restrictions that your account must be at least X days old and that it is limited to one account per person--just like the other freebies. You might get a sinsis sword or you might get a pile of dung, who knows. That way it is completely random with no auctionsnipers or autobuyers to deal with.

Sure, you will get a few cheaters--but Neo could keep a close check on it during that day to see if an IP went to it 10 times and then freeze the accounts on that IP address for multi-accounting.

Fantastic idea. Lets only hope something like it gets adopted. Would'nt it be nice!

I still think total randomness is the way to go here.